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DannoHung
2011-06-09, 7:14 PM
just kidding, they closed off the line literally right before me. and there was no one behind me. I almost cried :(

What? Seriously? Did he point at you and give you the Nelson laugh or something?

Bloody Jack
2011-06-09, 7:26 PM
Obviously the game sucks and they knew she would tell :gumshoe:

Nim
2011-06-09, 7:27 PM
Personal Starships... man even if everything else is total shit that almost makes it worth a try.

Jay
2011-06-09, 7:44 PM
personal starships and space battles are definite bonuses. Fucking cool.

AKBoarder
2011-06-09, 7:50 PM
I am not only buying this game but a laptop capable of playing it, just to play it, fuck tha haters.

DannoHung
2011-06-09, 8:00 PM
Dude... that seems dumb until some impressions are available, I mean, unless you were gonna buy a new laptop anyway.

Killjoy
2011-06-09, 8:29 PM
I am not only buying this game but a laptop capable of playing it, just to play it, fuck tha haters.
Well, at least the lightsabers don't look like giant glowing baseball bats anymore.

Bylak
2011-06-09, 8:56 PM
I'm gunna need to see a looooooot of this in action to make me think it's worth playing. I mean didn't SWG have ships and space battles too?

Killjoy
2011-06-09, 9:00 PM
I mean didn't SWG have ships and space battles too?
Yeah, personal space ships aren't new.

Bobulus
2011-06-09, 9:13 PM
Man...I promised myself I wouldn't go back after SWG sucked so much and WoW almost became an addiction.

This is going to be tricky.

Bloody Jack
2011-06-09, 9:16 PM
You aren't allowed to play any MMOs until after your MAME cabinet is finished, up, and running smoothly :crossarm:

Ringo
2011-06-09, 9:54 PM
One thing I heard about the spaceships is that it wasn't like Jump to Lightspeed where you could go anywhere you wanted. In this game you on rails to a specific location even in a battle. Is this true or some misinformation?

The Lazarus
2011-06-09, 9:56 PM
It's true. There are trailers earlier in the thread.

Macktacular
2011-06-10, 12:44 AM
Well it's very pretty looking, I will say that much.

But I am super cheap and refuse to pay money for a game more than once.

AKBoarder
2011-06-10, 1:29 AM
Dude... that seems dumb until some impressions are available, I mean, unless you were gonna buy a new laptop anyway.

I need a new laptop to play any newer games coming out, I'm still running with a 2009 Unibody Macbook (2 Ghz Core 2 Duo, 4GB Ram, Nvidia 9400M), and this is the first game that has actually made me want to upgrade and be able to play games released recently.

Wtgamerz
2011-06-10, 1:33 AM
I still remember our city in SWG. Good times indeed.

I also remember spending more time than I'll ever admit running in between collectors I had spread all over to gather my resources. My character was running 100 K's.

DannoHung
2011-06-10, 1:47 AM
I remember getting REALLY good at jumping off of my hoverbike so that I landed in the right spot instead of trying to slow it down somewhere near where I wanted to go.

GeoGonzo
2011-06-10, 2:04 AM
I have a friend who asked me pretty excited if I had seen the awesome intro of "The Old Republic". He then asked if the game was like the Jedi Knights games and... poor guy, he was so disappointed with my answer.

Gryphon
2011-06-10, 6:06 PM
One thing I heard about the spaceships is that it wasn't like Jump to Lightspeed where you could go anywhere you wanted. In this game you on rails to a specific location even in a battle. Is this true or some misinformation?

Your Ship is pretty much what the Ebon Hawk was in KotOR, the only difference is that it's bigger and will be customizable (on the inside at least). Other than that it'll act as a base for your companions where you'll be able to give them missions and have them craft items.

The space combat is on rails so don't get your hopes up if your into that kind of thing. Just think of them as housing that travels with you from planet to planet.

build me a star
2011-06-10, 6:39 PM
Your Ship is pretty much what the Ebon Hawk was in KotOR, the only difference is that it's bigger and will be customizable (on the inside at least). Other than that it'll act as a base for your companions where you'll be able to give them missions and have them craft items.

The space combat is on rails so don't get your hopes up if your into that kind of thing. Just think of them as housing that travels with you from planet to planet.
That actually sounds super sick.
What? Seriously? Did he point at you and give you the Nelson laugh or something?
Yeah pretty much :cry:

I was literally blinking back tears as I clutched my free poster and stormed away.

Ringo
2011-06-10, 6:53 PM
Your Ship is pretty much what the Ebon Hawk was in KotOR, the only difference is that it's bigger and will be customizable (on the inside at least). Other than that it'll act as a base for your companions where you'll be able to give them missions and have them craft items.

The space combat is on rails so don't get your hopes up if your into that kind of thing. Just think of them as housing that travels with you from planet to planet.

So there's no space PVP content I'm guessing? And speaking of crafting, I haven't heard a thing about it. Is there any information out there about it?

Gryphon
2011-06-10, 7:15 PM
So there's no space PVP content I'm guessing? And speaking of crafting, I haven't heard a thing about it. Is there any information out there about it?

Yea there's some info on crafting, there's a post on the ToR forums with info gathered so far, here's a link to the crafting part.
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=300223#anchor10

Basically your crew does the crafting for you and can also go on missions to gather items needed to craft. You can also collect components yourself but can't actually make a item unless you're a Jedi/Sith, then you and only you can make and upgrade your lightsabers.

Varrin
2011-06-10, 8:49 PM
I'm gunna need to see a looooooot of this in action to make me think it's worth playing. I mean didn't SWG have ships and space battles too?

Jump to Lightspeed was essentially X-Wing/Tie Fighter built into an MMO. It was actually pretty freaking awesome except for some bugs that could have been ironed out. Sadly it came to late to be appreciated by much more than the relatively small group of us that actually liked SWG and its philosophy of "Here is a world, go do stuff. No we don't care what and will not show you.". Until the Combat Update trashed everything fun about it of course.

This seems more like Space WoW, but there are neither elves or boars so I almost have to give it a shot.

Bobulus
2011-06-10, 9:01 PM
I loved the (though slightly dumbed down) X-wing/Tie Fighter stuff JTLS added, but my impression was that the average MMO player hated it, because they weren't used to twitchy combat, and most didn't own joysticks.

Also, there just wasn't a lot of point to it, since unlike ground combat, you couldn't fight territory wars over stuff, like you could with rebel/empire buildings on the ground.

DannoHung
2011-06-10, 9:47 PM
The whole SWG/EVE Online ethos of "Here's a grand world to make your own stories in" would work SO well if they'd just couple it with some tight gameplay. Like, ARGH, it's so frustrating that these games have the right high level concept and futz it up so bad on the details.

AKBoarder
2011-06-10, 10:16 PM
Agreeing with Danno pretty hard right now.

I feel like there must be a market for an open world game like that, and also a market for more quest driven games like WoW, and then another for very story driven games like LoTR:O

Moldywart
2011-06-11, 8:54 AM
Agreeing with Danno pretty hard right now.

I feel like there must be a market for an open world game like that, and also a market for more quest driven games like WoW, and then another for very story driven games like LoTR:O
Oh my god, was LoTR good in that respect. Hell, it was often more atmospheric then many single player RPGs.

I wanted to like it sooo much, but unfortunately the combat and class mechanics were just... off, boring somehow.

Alsio, I wonder why most games (I'm thinking of Rift in particular right now) don't allow UI customization to the extent that WoW does.
I always, ALWAYS find something about the UI that drives me nuts and I wish so hard that I could just download an addon to fix it.
Frankly it feels like a little arrogant, because no matter how good the reasons for not allowing addons are, WoW is overpowering proof that they just aren't good enough.

Edge
2011-06-11, 9:13 AM
Did WOW have UI customization right from launch? The Rift devs wanted to wait so they could do it right, but they have started releasing info on how it will work, and they have a addon subforum discussing the various things.

PagingCraig
2011-06-11, 9:44 AM
Did WOW have UI customization right from launch? The Rift devs wanted to wait so they could do it right, but they have started releasing info on how it will work, and they have a addon subforum discussing the various things.

Yes I had a custom UI in the beta, people were already modding it up

Bylak
2011-06-11, 4:29 PM
Does Rift still not have mods?! Man I couldn't stand the mail and AH systems.

Ryleh
2011-06-11, 4:40 PM
Does Rift still not have mods?! Man I couldn't stand the mail and AH systems.

They are putting the MOD api in this coming patch.

So all of the mod fanatics will be able to have as much functionality as they can stand.

Moldywart
2011-06-11, 6:42 PM
They are putting the MOD api in this coming patch.

So all of the mod fanatics will be able to have as much functionality as they can stand.
Well, I'd guess it would take at least another month or 2 for people to actually write some stuff.

Still, this just might convince me to go back to Rift. Though I did find the expert 5man dungeons a bit... dull, somehow. I can't really put a finger on it, but WoW 5mans feel like they have more variety and better "flow".

Maybe I just need to change class though. Only really tried mage so far.

Anywhere But Here
2011-06-12, 3:35 AM
Most of the people I know who have been able to play it are pretty keen on it and will definitely play it on launch. This is coming from some hardcore WoW players.

Sam
2011-06-12, 9:07 PM
Yeah, all the signs are looking good for TOR.

There's been like one negative article put out about TOR recently and it was a dumb as shit Kotaku article which actually just made me more confident in the game.

Yeah it's really that bad!

http://kotaku.com/5810509/the-more-they-keep-telling-me-star-wars-the-old-republic-isnt-like-world-of-warcraft-the-less-i-want-to-play

there are so many things emphatically wrong with this type of 'gaming journalism' that I want to see how many you can catch before he is whining about characters in star wars sporting capes and headgear.

Wtgamerz
2011-06-12, 9:15 PM
My cousin has some close friends working on it. He said the game is looking bad ass. I'm hoping I can snag a beta invite from him.

Leo
2011-06-12, 10:51 PM
gaming journalism.jpeg

http://www.exotic-footwear.com/big_jpg/clown.jpg

Gryphon
2011-06-13, 12:31 AM
I've realized through the many MMOs I've played I just really, really hate leveling. I'm hoping that all the story that is getting crammed into TOR will help ease the pain.

The Lazarus
2011-06-14, 8:42 PM
Two impressions from PC Gamer when they played it back in March:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/06/13/17-hours-with-star-wars-the-old-republic/
http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/06/13/17-hours-with-star-wars-the-old-republic%E2%80%99s-agent

Gryphon
2011-06-14, 9:05 PM
I've read those the other day and I thought it was interesting how different the reactions were from the two. The issues that the guy playing the bounty hunter had with groups was some of the things I was wondering about but I really don't think you'll see that many people pairing up with the same class outside of Flashpoints (dungeons) and Operations (raids) so it shouldn't be a problem really.

Matt
2011-06-14, 10:38 PM
Wait so the game is supposed to be good again now? I can't keep up with these constantly shifting preconceptions anymore.

DannoHung
2011-06-14, 10:50 PM
It's in superposition. The waveform won't be collapsed for the universe you inhabit until you play it.

Though I think the calls that are going out that they're just doing WoW in Star Wars clothing seem a little unfair. There's at least a little innovation going on with the companion characters, the crafting system, and the companion quests. The cover system is also pretty interesting for PvE, though I have to wonder if PvP is going to be worth anything at all. Which seems pretty sad since PvP would make for a much more logical end-game than endless top tier dungeon raids.

Then again, they're claiming to have the equivalent of a thousand hours of single player campaign across all the classes.... so maybe it'll work out.

DreamOfTheRood
2011-06-15, 7:24 AM
Opening Cinematic.

QyYbvVAtlWk

Drascus
2011-06-15, 7:33 AM
It's in superposition. The waveform won't be collapsed for the universe you inhabit until you play it.

Though I think the calls that are going out that they're just doing WoW in Star Wars clothing seem a little unfair. There's at least a little innovation going on with the companion characters, the crafting system, and the companion quests. The cover system is also pretty interesting for PvE, though I have to wonder if PvP is going to be worth anything at all. Which seems pretty sad since PvP would make for a much more logical end-game than endless top tier dungeon raids.

Then again, they're claiming to have the equivalent of a thousand hours of single player campaign across all the classes.... so maybe it'll work out.

Guild Wars already did the companion system. Hell, now you can even turn your other PCs into companions there!

Jimmy McForum
2011-06-15, 7:47 AM
Opening Cinematic.

QyYbvVAtlWk
Realistically, I am never going to play this game.

I will watch all the cinematics, though. That five minute clip felt more Star Wars than the first two prequels. Amazing.

Jay
2011-06-15, 7:57 AM
Yeah the cinematics are undeniably cool. It's like a tease of how cool the prequels could have been if Lucas wasn't such a fucking moron.

Killjoy
2011-06-15, 8:09 AM
The cover system is also pretty interesting for PvE
The cover system is class-restricted, which really strikes me as odd.

As I said 6 months ago after playing in the beta, the game had some big problems but given time they could be fixed. I didn't think it was likely, but they could.

http://www.forumopolis.com/showpost.php?p=3586111&postcount=278

http://www.forumopolis.com/showpost.php?p=3587206&postcount=307

Looking over my old list of cons:

* Regarding my issue with the environments, the below article said the following, "The environments in TOR are incredibly grand, though from a graphical standpoint, the visuals are hardly breathtaking. The scale of everything is impressive to look at, and character animations run smoothly enough (just ignore all the creepy expressionless faces). Yet simplified shapes and heavy desaturation give the game a somewhat cartoony appearance, resulting in a World of Warcraft 2.0 feel."

http://www.neoseeker.com/news/16628-star-wars-the-old-republic-e3-2011-hands-on/

* Overall the graphics look about the same from what I can tell from videos and screenshots. They're substandard for what they should be, in my opinion.

* Character animations also appear about the same? It's difficult to tell from videos because you aren't controlling the motions.

* Some articles haven't minded the combat, but others have said that it's a bit dull. This appears to be consistent with my original assessment.

* I haven't seen anything about the game's morality choices, but I doubt that has changed.

* The progressing choice of character classes (you pick an "advanced" class at level 10) is still in the game. I say again: This has never gone over well in MMOs. It didn't work in DAoC, it didn't work in AoC, and it didn't work in EQ2. It's a bad idea.

With all of that said, will I buy the game? Yes, I probably will. Voting with your dollar works wonders, and I want better and more immersive storytelling in MMOs. The only way that's going to happen going forward is if a trailblazer is successful. My feelings from 6 months ago where I reacted poorly to the game may repeat themselves when it goes live, but I want to encourage the industry to pay more attention to story immersion - not the way World of Warcraft does it, but the way Star Wars the Old Republic does it.

DEDALVS, Esq.
2011-06-15, 8:23 AM
Wait so the game is supposed to be good again now? I can't keep up with these constantly shifting preconceptions anymore.

The game is fine, it's just not shattering any MMO-walls or doing things any differently, for the most part.

Bylak
2011-06-15, 8:41 AM
Wait so the game is supposed to be good again now? I can't keep up with these constantly shifting preconceptions anymore.

My opinion that it's going to be bad hasn't changed. It doesn't look like much has substantially changed from the videos released half a year ago compared to what it looks like now.

Bobulus
2011-06-15, 8:53 AM
I think whether or not I buy this will depend heavily on how many people on FO are buying it.

Munchausen
2011-06-15, 9:07 AM
If it's WoW with lightsabers and a much, much, much better story element, then I suppose I'll end up liking it.

DannoHung
2011-06-15, 11:28 AM
Guild Wars already did the companion system. Hell, now you can even turn your other PCs into companions there!

I haven't played Guild Wars in ages, but what I remember from it was that you could hire henchmen like in Diablo. I don't know how this system is going to compare to the one in Guild Wars, but on the surface the companions seem far more integral to the experience in Old Republic

Smaug
2011-06-15, 11:58 AM
That cinematic almost convinces me to buy the game even though I haven't been keeping up on anything concerning it.

Sprint
2011-06-15, 1:14 PM
It kind of tickles me to think that Bioware as a company has so much of its genesis in Star Wars and Dungeons and Dragons

It's like when two terrible nerds reproduce and their child is an ubermensch

Drascus
2011-06-15, 1:16 PM
I haven't played Guild Wars in ages, but what I remember from it was that you could hire henchmen like in Diablo. I don't know how this system is going to compare to the one in Guild Wars, but on the surface the companions seem far more integral to the experience in Old Republic

They've been constantly improving their companion system, including the recent addition of creating a custom companion with the look, name, and skillset of one of your other characters.

Trax
2011-06-15, 1:53 PM
They have? Awesome.

Trax
2011-06-15, 1:55 PM
That reminds me, how is the naming system working? Is it like say Champions Online where you can have any name you want because it's attached to a global/server name, or is it going to be like other games where you're going to have to get lucky/creative with names because other people will likely have taken them already?

Sprint
2011-06-15, 1:56 PM
If you can't whip up a unique Star Wars character name you are a failure as a human being.

Killjoy
2011-06-15, 2:00 PM
That reminds me, how is the naming system working? Is it like say Champions Online where you can have any name you want because it's attached to a global/server name, or is it going to be like other games where you're going to have to get lucky/creative with names because other people will likely have taken them already?
I don't 100% recall from the beta, but I believe each name is unique.

To be honest I'm a little surprised that this is a concern in a Star Wars game. I understand naming concerns in a super hero game because your name and appearance are extremely relevant to your character's branding, but in fantasy games, sci-fi, etc just name them whatever.

Edit - Names like Solo and Skywalker are probably going to be prohibited anyway, if that's where you were going with this.

AKBoarder
2011-06-15, 2:24 PM
I want to be Hanluke Soloskywalker

Jimmy McForum
2011-06-15, 2:26 PM
If you can't whip up a unique Star Wars character name you are a failure as a human being.
Is ch00b4kk4 taken yet?

Mr. Snarky
2011-06-15, 2:27 PM
Duke Cloudstrider

Caleddin
2011-06-15, 2:29 PM
Elliot Dawnbreaker.

frobbnik
2011-06-15, 2:44 PM
we can't just use our Pornstar Names?

HauntedPixel
2011-06-15, 3:57 PM
Frankfort Goldenrod

build me a star
2011-06-15, 5:01 PM
If it's WoW with lightsabers and a much, much, much better story element, then I suppose I'll end up liking it.
Pretty much this.

Jobrill
2011-06-15, 5:04 PM
Still refusing to like this on account that it isn't mass effect

DannoHung
2011-06-15, 6:20 PM
Dibs on Roll Fizzlebeef

Default_Messiah
2011-06-16, 10:21 PM
I have nothing to really add to besides that whenever I think of Smuggler VS Sith warrior PvP, this is the clip that always comes to mind;

sULTwrKipc

Wtgamerz
2011-06-23, 1:00 PM
Gabe from Penny Arcade posted his thoughts on playing in the beta for more than a month, and I am very excited by some of his comments.

Can't wait to hear more or perhaps win at life and get in the beta.

Darius Sontag
2011-06-23, 1:05 PM
Gabe from Penny Arcade posted his thoughts on playing in the beta for more than a month, and I am very excited by some of his comments.

Can't wait to hear more or perhaps win at life and get in the beta.

Huh, a massively multiplayer rpg that's an rpg.

Ok, I'm picking this up.

Athos
2011-06-23, 1:05 PM
My co-worker is in the beta. Generally, he likes it. He likes the character progression and the stories, and he's enjoyed PVP. He says crowd control is a little wacky right now and can be easily abused though.

He HATES the space component. He says its a pointless, repetitive grind that is completley railed without freedom to really fly your ship.

Killjoy
2011-06-23, 2:36 PM
He HATES the space component. He says its a pointless, repetitive grind that is completley railed without freedom to really fly your ship.
That's disappointing. I'd wondered how fun space was going to be when Bioware first announced that it was on rails. They said that they wanted it to be like in the movies where there wasn't aimless wandering, and that the protagonists went from exciting scene to exciting scene. But how is that any different from the movie's adventures on the ground, versus wandering in a MMO? It's a poor rationale, IMO, and the result is a crappy feature.

Ringo
2011-06-23, 2:46 PM
R-Type: StarWars. Not what I was hoping for.

Xyzandra
2011-06-23, 2:52 PM
I wonder if we can recreate Parsec.

I have gone from game to game to guild to guild trying to recapture that magic.

Athos
2011-06-23, 2:58 PM
R-Type: StarWars. Not what I was hoping for.

His comparison was Space Harrier, so pretty close.

He said its a lot like the space scenes in Lego Star Wars II. Your ship is on a path and you can turn the nose and make slight course adjustments, but its basically just endless shooting, no dodging, and you have to do it over and over and over again.

Phantom
2011-06-23, 3:19 PM
I wonder how many Chiss agents are going to be named either Jack T. Chance or Kurt Wagner?

Trax
2011-06-23, 3:53 PM
I've always liked Star Fox, and from the few short clips I've seen it seemed to be similar to that so I think I'll be fine with the space scenes. Otherwise it'll be like Jump To Lightspeed for SWG again, people pissed off that they have to buy a joystick and use twitch combat and it adds nothing to the ground experience.

Xyzandra
2011-06-23, 4:02 PM
I never used a joystick and I was awesome in my Green Bulbasaur (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Belbullab-22_starfighter).

But I liked JtL, so perhaps I'm a little biased.

My Bulbasaur was totally awesome though.

The Lazarus
2011-06-23, 4:07 PM
I wonder how many Chiss agents are going to be named either Jack T. Chance or Kurt Wagner?
One is too many.

Wtgamerz
2011-06-23, 4:07 PM
I wonder if we can recreate Parsec.

I have gone from game to game to guild to guild trying to recapture that magic.
.

Artemius
2011-06-23, 4:57 PM
He HATES the space component. He says its a pointless, repetitive grind that is completley railed without freedom to really fly your ship.

Could you ask him how exactly is it grindy? Do you need to run a lot of missions for the best gear on the ground, or to gain access to something important? Or is it because there are only very few missions so you end up memorizing them? Also, do you need to repair the damage your ship sustains in one run, or is it automatically restored to pristine state when you enter the next mission?

As an Xwing/Tie fighter vet, I was initially disappointed when the "on rails" info was released, but I was willing to give it the benefit of the doubt since I also liked starfox and its ilk.

Aaod
2011-06-23, 5:16 PM
I wonder if we can recreate Parsec.

I have gone from game to game to guild to guild trying to recapture that magic.
Parsec was amazing, I was tempted to stay subscribed for 15 bucks a month just to read guild chat.

DannoHung
2011-06-23, 5:16 PM
If it's like PDO or Rez or Child of Eden, it could be pretty fun. The on rails shooter is not a bad genre, just not what you necessarily expect from Star Wars.

Phantom
2011-06-23, 5:25 PM
One is too many.
I may have to do it myself just to spite you.

EDIT: Ooh, or I could create Miley Lohan and make her a PVP character.

Sam
2011-06-23, 6:21 PM
The on-rails thing is a shoehorn. They WANT you to be able to use your ship (instead of just having it be a glorified world taxi) and they want to fit in cinematic space battles, but it was just unfeasible to have an open-world space element with a thousand players running around in their exactly three ship types per faction. I would expect this element to grow over time, but for now it's just some spoo spoo on rails because that's pretty much all they can have.

If they made it an obligatory grind, that's bad though.

DannoHung
2011-06-23, 6:43 PM
Well, sure it's a shoehorn, I'm just saying it's not necessarily going to be not-fun by virtue of being an on-rails shooter. I don't know about grind though. On rails shooters should be as flow-inducing as vertical or sidescrolling shmups at their best.

White Tyger
2011-06-25, 12:37 PM
The more I've watched videos & read about The Old Republic MMO, the more I've started looking forward to it. Not thrilled with the space rail combat choice but, everything else I've seen looks good.

Killjoy
2011-07-21, 7:35 AM
Pre-ordering is now available with early live game access:

http://www.swtor.com/preorder

Jay
2011-07-21, 8:00 AM
The box art I've looks fucking cool as hell, I'll give it that.

Wtgamerz
2011-07-21, 9:00 AM
Grabbed a CE off amazon. And already got my "early access" key. So I guess I'll play a few days early, then wait a week or two after launch since it'll be impossible to do anything with everyone on.

FFTimberwolf
2011-07-21, 1:19 PM
So, those of you in the Beta, did this thing ever improve to the point people would recommend it? Early testers talked about it being trash, but it's sort of quietly been out there and I've not heard a thing (which makes me think that no, it hasnt improved)

build me a star
2011-07-21, 1:49 PM
Guh still Windows only

build me a star
2011-07-21, 1:49 PM
So, those of you in the Beta, did this thing ever improve to the point people would recommend it? Early testers talked about it being trash, but it's sort of quietly been out there and I've not heard a thing (which makes me think that no, it hasnt improved)
There are actually a lot of really positive reviews floating around. Did you bother to look, or are you just going by this thread?

Killjoy
2011-07-21, 2:32 PM
I wonder if we can recreate Parsec.

I have gone from game to game to guild to guild trying to recapture that magic.
Many of the original Parsec members are long gone, and no longer visit this forum.

Trax
2011-07-21, 3:49 PM
I got the CE from GameStop, the one from the EA origin store was already sold out. Lucky for me GameStop seemed to have it available.

Oh god I spent close to $200 on this..how much was the CE for SWG again? Then again..I also was a sucker for the Lifetime Membership or whatever for Champions Online..

Good thing I don't have many bills to pay..

FFTimberwolf
2011-07-21, 4:24 PM
There are actually a lot of really positive reviews floating around. Did you bother to look, or are you just going by this thread?

You mean FO isnt a perfect representation of real life? :cry:
I've known a few non FO people who were in it, but havent mentioned anything in some time. I've also stumbled across a few articles. I havent looked recently, thus the question.

Fry
2011-07-21, 4:34 PM
Many of the original Parsec members are long gone, and no longer visit this forum.

There's maybe half of us left, I'd wager. I haven't played an MMO in quite awhile, but I'm thinking hard about playing this one.

It's funny, but I think about it every day. There's a company right next to my office that's actually named Parsec. They do something for the railroad.

Trax
2011-07-21, 5:03 PM
How long did it take you guys before the Early Access came in after you pre-ordered the game? All I have right now is the confirmation e-mail from the shop.

Chauntalei
2011-07-21, 5:10 PM
Just put in my pre-order. Didn't try for a CE, since I'm still not sure if I'll stick around long enough to justify it. Definitely interested in playing with some FO folk once things are live though!

Killjoy
2011-07-21, 5:14 PM
How long did it take you guys before the Early Access came in after you pre-ordered the game? All I have right now is the confirmation e-mail from the ship.
Seconds later from Amazon; maybe a minute or two tops.

Gryphon
2011-07-21, 5:24 PM
I had to get the digital deluxe as the CE were all sold out at Amazon and the origin store. I've been burned before from Gamestop so I don't pre order from them anymore. The only thing that I'll miss from the CE is the special store.

Trax
2011-07-21, 5:27 PM
Damnit, it's been hours now. I'll wait until tomorrow I guess, but then I'm giving them a fucking call.

I had to get the digital deluxe as the CE were all sold out at Amazon and the origin store. I've been burned before from Gamestop so I don't pre order from them anymore. The only thing that I'll miss from the CE is the special store.

I pre-ordered from GameStop, I guess I should've just done the Digital Deluxe from Origin. If Gamestop screws me, then I'll cancel the pre-order and go to Origin.

Wtgamerz
2011-07-21, 5:38 PM
Got my code from Amazon immediately. I heard that people from Best Buy have to wait up to 24 hours.

Chauntalei
2011-07-21, 5:39 PM
Damnit, it's been hours now. I'll wait until tomorrow I guess, but then I'm giving them a fucking call.



I pre-ordered from GameStop, I guess I should've just done the Digital Deluxe from Origin. If Gamestop screws me, then I'll cancel the pre-order and go to Origin.

Gamestop says up to 24 hours for the code. I preordered mine from them as well.

Trax
2011-07-21, 5:48 PM
Damn. Guess I'll have to wait then. >:( The (sold out) Origin CE said 48 hours, so I guess it's better than nothing..

Sam
2011-07-21, 5:49 PM
I need an explanation of what the color crystal is. I don't understand what it does.

Wtgamerz
2011-07-21, 5:50 PM
I've seen a LOT of venom on certain sites about not getting their codes right away, but with release still a ways away, does it really matter if it takes a day or two? It's not like you'll get to play tomorrow. Some people are going INSANE because they didn't get their code right away.

Chauntalei
2011-07-21, 5:52 PM
I need an explanation of what the color crystal is. I don't understand what it does.

I'm assuming it's like the crystals you could pick up in Force Unleashed. It changes the color of your lightsaber, as well as adding an additional effect (restore health, restore force power, etc). I could be totally wrong though!

The Lazarus
2011-07-21, 5:54 PM
I need an explanation of what the color crystal is. I don't understand what it does.
Changes the color of your lightsaber and the bolts your gun fires. So you could shoot purple lasers instead of standard blue.

TiltingWindmills
2011-07-22, 1:35 PM
So, those of you in the Beta, did this thing ever improve to the point people would recommend it? Early testers talked about it being trash, but it's sort of quietly been out there and I've not heard a thing (which makes me think that no, it hasnt improved)

My husband has been in both Beta groups and it's changed a lot from the first to the second. After I quit playing WoW I didn't think I'd ever want to play another MMO ever again but I will be playing TOR. :ermm:

Bloody Jack
2011-07-22, 1:59 PM
Got my code from Amazon immediately. I heard that people from Best Buy have to wait up to 24 hours.

I tried to preorder the CE yesterday around 6pm from Amazon but they were sold out :(

Wtgamerz
2011-07-22, 2:02 PM
Best Buy still has them listed on their site for preorder.

EDIT: AND AMAZON does as well. Better hurry to grab one.

Trax
2011-07-22, 2:08 PM
Finally got my code earlier today and registered.

Bloody Jack
2011-07-22, 2:10 PM
$150.00!?! FFFFFFFFFFffffffffffff.....



OK goddamnit, but if this game sucks, bioware is going to die in a fire :angry:

Stirny
2011-07-22, 4:01 PM
I ordered a CE from Gamestop for myself and ordered a CE from Best Buy for my wife, my wife got her code emailed to her within a hour, Gamestop is apparently taking 24-48 hours. I am not to worried about it, a lot of people are freaking out though because apparently the time you put your code in decides how early you get access.

Phantom
2011-07-22, 4:08 PM
I just dropped money for the digital deluxe edition. Largely because I want the mount that looks like what Orion of the New Gods cruised around on.

Xyzandra
2011-08-06, 2:00 PM
£129 for the collectors edition? Assuming you can find anywhere it isn't sold out.


Sheeesh. Looks like I'll have to go for the Digital version which is £59. Which is still overpriced but I want the toys.

Kamileon
2011-08-06, 2:21 PM
Where are people getting their codes from? I bought the digital regular version.

frogurt
2011-08-06, 2:24 PM
Anyone know when TOR is likely to be released? I've heard that the game is still months away from having enough content to go gold.

Wtgamerz
2011-08-06, 3:11 PM
Hopefully this holiday season, but who knows.

Gryphon
2011-08-06, 3:25 PM
I think the content is pretty much finished and that they're mostly waiting on all the voice acting to get synced and placed. They also want a world wide release and localizing this game seems like it'll be a major effort so that's probably adding to the delay.

AKBoarder
2011-08-06, 4:43 PM
I better not have to wait to play laser sword with aliens cuz of a bunch of damn frrrnners

Sully
2011-08-06, 4:52 PM
150?!

God help me, I might still do it.

Trax
2011-08-06, 4:59 PM
Seems like they sent a bunch of invitations out to Canadians this round. I didn't get anything. :(

Moldywart
2011-08-06, 8:02 PM
I better not have to wait to play laser sword with aliens cuz of a bunch of damn frrrnners
The flip side is that even though some suit decided it's "stable enough" for release, every day it gets delayed will make the launch smoother.

I'd bet dollars to donuts that on any project of this kind, the programmers would like several months more time, and it is dragged kicking and screaming out of development and onto the market by the management.

Sam
2011-08-06, 8:12 PM
November is the most likely release. At least, this is for sure when they are PLANNING to release it. They might always delay for polish, of course.

Maz
2011-08-08, 8:48 AM
My wife got into beta and I did not.. I think it's cause she is Canadian >.<

Or they are just doing one per household, and both of our applications are from the same IP.

Wtgamerz
2011-08-08, 8:52 AM
My wife got into beta and I did not.. I think it's cause she is Canadian >.<

Or they are just doing one per household, and both of our applications are from the same IP.

You know what to do.

Maz
2011-08-08, 8:54 AM
I do indeed :D

Wait, we are talking about getting a shitload of chloroform right?

Maz
2011-08-12, 2:44 PM
ha! beta access is mine! I didn't need the chloroform after all. I just needed to knock her up.

The things we do for beta access :banjo:

build me a star
2011-08-12, 3:21 PM
I gots a new computer now that I just partitioned and Bootcamped so yesss now I has Windows

*immediately signs up for beta*

Zetwilder
2011-08-12, 3:29 PM
ha! beta access is mine! I didn't need the chloroform after all. I just needed to knock her up.

The things we do for beta access :banjo:

Imagine if this became a new trend for all nerds. :disgust:

Maz
2011-08-15, 8:47 AM
We would take over the world!


Also. This is so a day one purchase for us. And not because it has Star Wars in the name.

Bloody Jack
2011-08-15, 2:03 PM
If it's a day one purchase then maybe preorder for the free goodies? I just wish the game would come out already :ermm:

Killjoy
2011-08-15, 10:10 PM
Guild testing has begun For those with at least 10 members.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=8273895#post8273895

Gryphon
2011-08-16, 1:03 AM
Well damn now I wish I joined that little guild in this thread.... Wait, Republic guild? Nevermind. :disgust:

Trax
2011-08-16, 1:13 AM
Wish I had done the same.

Killjoy
2011-08-16, 10:55 AM
Join whatever you can, guys. They haven't said anything about a cut-off point that I saw.

Sam
2011-08-16, 12:33 PM
http://www.swtor.com/guilds/115888/x-com

JOIN ME AND WE SHALL RULE THE WORLD

Sprint
2011-08-16, 12:52 PM
Can you preorder on Steam or do you have to go brick and mortar?

Killjoy
2011-08-16, 12:58 PM
Can you preorder on Steam or do you have to go brick and mortar?
It's not on Steam. If you want digital you'll have to go with EA's Origin service. See the options at the below site:

http://www.swtor.com/preorder

Sprint
2011-08-16, 1:06 PM
I'd rather buy from Amazon, fuck giving EA 100% of my money.

Also, fuck Bioware for making the Smuggler companion a Wookie. Great, I get to be Han Solo.

Ugh.

Killjoy
2011-08-16, 1:12 PM
Also, fuck Bioware for making the Smuggler companion a Wookie. Great, I get to be Han Solo.

Ugh.
I rolled my eyes at that companion as well. Bioware is unashamedly going for some of the "iconic" Star Wars stereotypes. The good news is that you can eventually get more companions than just the one.

Edit: It's a total of five companions per class -

http://www.torbb.com/swtor-news/10265-swtor-list-player-companions.html

Talkinsquirrel
2011-08-16, 1:36 PM
http://www.swtor.com/guilds/115888/x-com

JOIN ME AND WE SHALL RULE THE WORLD

Totally applied. If I don't get into beta I'm blaming you Sam.

Sprint
2011-08-16, 1:49 PM
I rolled my eyes at that companion as well. Bioware is unashamedly going for some of the "iconic" Star Wars stereotypes. The good news is that you can eventually get more companions than just the one.

Edit: It's a total of five companions per class -

http://www.torbb.com/swtor-news/10265-swtor-list-player-companions.html

Oh my God the fucking Smuggler starship

Gryphon
2011-08-16, 2:01 PM
Oh my God the fucking Smuggler starship

I know! It's totally a rip off of the Ebon Hawk!

Jaaboo
2011-08-16, 3:03 PM
I applied. Viva la revolu.... er, um, viva la republic?

Sprint
2011-08-16, 3:07 PM
I just preordered the regular version on Amazon. Fuck $150 CE's.

Hawque
2011-08-16, 3:56 PM
I just preordered from GameStop, regular edition as well. Apparently I had $5 of unused credit from preordering Force Unleashed 2, so that was simple enough to get done.

Makes no Spence
2011-08-16, 4:17 PM
Just preordered mine. Hoping I get in the beta, though I think they're going to be having a demo/letting people to play it at PAX so I'll maybe get a shot at playing it there in 2 weeks. We shall see! Either way, excited for this.

Makes no Spence
2011-08-16, 4:32 PM
Aaaand I'm an idiot and didn't look into if it worked on Macs and it doesn't sooooo I guess I'm SOL. Canceling pre-order. It would've looked so pretty on my iMac, too. :(

I"m not buying Windows 7 for so I can run the game through Bootcamp, not worth it at the moment...

Sprint
2011-08-16, 4:32 PM
Mac owners don't deserve Bioware games

Makes no Spence
2011-08-16, 4:40 PM
Mac owners don't deserve Bioware games

:( I'm pretty sad about this; I was looking forward to a new MMORPG to play in the fall and winter.

Sprint
2011-08-16, 4:41 PM
Don't worry, World of Warcraft will kill it and chew it up and spit out the bones after sucking out the marrow.

Sam
2011-08-16, 4:51 PM
:( I'm pretty sad about this; I was looking forward to a new MMORPG to play in the fall and winter.

bootcamp it. even bioware employees do it.

Sprint
2011-08-16, 4:53 PM
bootcamp it. even bioware employees do it.
Aaaand I'm an idiot and didn't look into if it worked on Macs and it doesn't sooooo I guess I'm SOL. Canceling pre-order. It would've looked so pretty on my iMac, too. :(

I"m not buying Windows 7 for so I can run the game through Bootcamp, not worth it at the moment...

.

Kamileon
2011-08-16, 5:00 PM
Husband has his mac set up in some weird way with his hard drives that he can't bootcamp, but he has pledged to redo his whatevertheshit just so he can play Star Wars.

Makes no Spence
2011-08-16, 5:20 PM
I'm not dropping nearly $200 to play it, especially when I've yet to see if it'll even last or become another Age of Conan or Warhammer Online.

Sam
2011-08-16, 5:29 PM
.

aha. well, for what it's worth, they seem to have made sure it runs without problems on bootcamp, so the option is, at least, there for others.

Killjoy
2011-08-17, 3:51 PM
Someone on the official SWTOR forum pulled some interesting statistics (assuming they're accurate):

Guilds with more than 10 members

Republic

Total of 1574 guilds with 41404 members.

Members - Guilds
>400 -------- 4
200-400 ----- 15
100-199 ----- 28
50-99 -------- 87
20-49 -------- 460
11-19 -------- 980


Empire

Total of 2165 guilds with 53702 members.

Members - Guilds
>400 -------- 7
200-400 ----- 9
100-199 ----- 32
50-99 -------- 105
20-49 -------- 577
11-19 -------- 1435


Here is the distribution according to server type...

Type - Empire - Republic - Total
PvE --- 17327 ---- 18262 --- 35589
PvP --- 31556 ---- 15093 --- 46649
RP ----- 4819 ----- 8049 ---- 12868
Totals - 53702 --- 41404 --- 95106http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=434802

Sprint
2011-08-17, 3:54 PM
Sigh, yet another MMO where everyone wants to be the bad guys.

edit: lol at the pvp numbers

Jobrill
2011-08-17, 3:56 PM
I dunno, as long we don't get "The Horde/Sith are ACTUALLY GOOD" stuff, I can put up with it.

Sprint
2011-08-17, 3:59 PM
No, it's just that pvp people are fucking morons and always play the "evil" side.

It means Bioware has to learn from Warhammer Online if they want to have meaningful pvp. Or, well, not have meaningful pvp.

DEDALVS, Esq.
2011-08-17, 4:14 PM
I dunno, as long we don't get "The Horde/Sith are ACTUALLY GOOD" stuff, I can put up with it.

DARTH SIDIUS WANTED TO BE IN SILVERMOON, JOBRILL.

Jobrill
2011-08-17, 4:31 PM
DARTH SIDIUS WANTED TO BE IN SILVERMOON, JOBRILL.

Darth Maul is totally a good guy. That is why he just killed 100 Republic Troopers, then freed the Jawas from their slavemaster only to immediately appoint him their leader again.

Gryphon
2011-08-17, 6:45 PM
No side is good or evil in SWTOR, it's the characters. You can be in the Empire and be considered "light side" and you can be a "dark side" Republic member. It's not just the force uesers either, they gave examples of a light side Imperial Agent that actually believes that the Empire is the right way to go and will actually bring peace. Or you could be a bloodthirsty Republic Trooper that shoots first and asks questions later.

There's been more than a few examples where you can chose to outright kill innocents as Republic just so you can take a shortcut or get more loot so it's not just the Empire that get all the fun.

Sprint
2011-08-17, 6:47 PM
So then there's going to be good Sith, who are the very epitome of baby eating, scenery chewing supervillains.

edit: also, read about the NPC's in the game on the web site. All of the Imperial NPC's fucking drink baby optic fluid and make their shoes out of live puppies.

Jobrill
2011-08-17, 6:54 PM
Yesssssssssssssssss. Another MMO where the lore revolves around an Evil Bastard PC Faction that spends all its time bitching about how they're totally misunderstood and the Good PC faction is just a bunch of bigoted assholes.

THIS IS WHAT WE NEEDED.

THIS.

THIS RIGHT HERE.

Killjoy
2011-08-17, 6:54 PM
So then there's going to be good Sith, who are the very epitome of baby eating, scenery chewing supervillains.

edit: also, read about the NPC's in the game on the web site. All of the Imperial NPC's fucking drink baby optic fluid and make their shoes out of live puppies.
I read someone say that a common difference between "good" Sith and "bad" Sith is killing a thousand people, or killing a thousand people slowly and painfully.

Sprint
2011-08-17, 6:56 PM
I read someone say that a common difference between "good" Sith and "bad" Sith is killing a thousand people, or killing a thousand people slowly and painfully.

The careful, thoughtful, nuanced examination of morality I've come to expect from Bioware.

Phantom
2011-08-17, 7:00 PM
The careful, thoughtful, nuanced examination of morality I've come to expect from Bioware.

Nah. True Bioware would be to save those thousand babies. And if you choose not to save them, you force your lifedebted Wookkie friend to eat them.

Gryphon
2011-08-17, 8:00 PM
Nah. True Bioware would be to save those thousand babies. And if you choose not to save them, you force your lifedebted Wookkie friend to eat them.

That was pretty awesome. It totally made up for all the other lame evil choices.

You're never going to be able to be truly sith-like because the game in rated T last I checked and I'm pretty sure that committing torture for your own amusement is more of a M rating. It really does bum me out though because there's going to be so much story dedicated to being a bad guy and I just know it's going to be the lame kind of evil.

Maz
2011-08-18, 5:51 PM
http://www.swtor.com/guilds/115888/x-com

JOIN ME AND WE SHALL RULE THE WORLD


I applied! Would be nice if I could get an account and see the guild stuff. I don't get to try my wife's that much :(

TiltingWindmills
2011-08-18, 8:05 PM
MMO's are pretty much ruined by the fact that they are filled with people. It's impossible to write anything nuanced for most of the people who will be playing them.

DEDALVS, Esq.
2011-08-18, 8:09 PM
Yesssssssssssssssss. Another MMO where the lore revolves around an Evil Bastard PC Faction that spends all its time bitching about how they're totally misunderstood and the Good PC faction is just a bunch of bigoted assholes.

THIS IS WHAT WE NEEDED.

THIS.

THIS RIGHT HERE.

It also has talent trees.

Sam
2011-08-18, 8:26 PM
No side is good or evil in SWTOR, it's the characters.

The Empire is evil. The Sith are evil. Not 'misunderstood,' they are the bad guys.

Tomlin
2011-08-19, 12:25 PM
Well I just got into beta, who else is in?

Talkinsquirrel
2011-08-19, 12:27 PM
Well I just got into beta, who else is in?

QUICK EAT HIS HEART AND GET HIS BETA ACCESS

Wtgamerz
2011-08-19, 12:33 PM
Kill him!!

Jobrill
2011-08-19, 12:37 PM
The Empire is evil. The Sith are evil. Not 'misunderstood,' they are the bad guys.

FROM MY POINT OF VIEW THE JEDI ARE EVIL

Wtgamerz
2011-08-19, 12:39 PM
FROM MY POINT OF VIEW THE JEDI ARE EVIL

Lucas probably thought that line was Oscar worthy.

Gryphon
2011-08-19, 2:22 PM
The Empire is evil. The Sith are evil. Not 'misunderstood,' they are the bad guys.

They're not misunderstood but they're also not evil. The Sith are like animals in the wild they do what they want, their only limitation is whatever is strong enough to stop them. The Jedi are domesticated, they still hear the call of the wild but fear to answer because it's safe and warm in their cages.

I do agree that light side Sith are BS and really shouldn't be in the game. Light side empire is believable, just not Sith.

Jobrill
2011-08-19, 2:23 PM
I don't care what some whiny RPer says. Sith are evil.

build me a star
2011-08-19, 5:10 PM
ughhhhh I wanna play this game noowwwww

Hawque
2011-08-19, 5:22 PM
http://www.joystiq.com/2011/08/19/the-old-republic-gets-a-somewhat-lighthearted-huttball-warzone/
If you ever feel like taking a break from cutting through folks with laserswords, Star Wars: The Old Republic will include a somewhat wackier game mode that should suit your needs. It's called "Huttball" -- a neutral Player vs. Player Warzone which is likely the closest thing the MMO will have to an official sport. Unless, of course, they invent ligthsaber baseball, which seems unlikely for several obvious reasons.

The game tasks two teams with securing a neutral ball and running it into the opposing teams endzone. Just like football! Only with more Force-choking. Check out the trailer above to get a taste of space sports.

Panic at the Sisko
2011-08-19, 5:35 PM
major major lol at the idea that the sith aren't evil

Gryphon
2011-08-19, 6:27 PM
I don't care what some whiny RPer says. Sith are evil.



Hey! I resent that! I don't RP.

Archangel3d
2011-08-19, 7:16 PM
major major lol at the idea that the sith aren't evil

Rebranding. It worked for the Horde.

Dax
2011-08-19, 8:14 PM
Sith aren't evil. Sith are amoral.

Maz
2011-08-19, 8:16 PM
http://www.joystiq.com/2011/08/19/the-old-republic-gets-a-somewhat-lighthearted-huttball-warzone/

I wish I could talk about this. I really really wish I could talk about this.

frogurt
2011-08-19, 8:21 PM
I wish I could talk about this. I really really wish I could talk about this.
Hey Maz, completely unrelated question, but what's your favorite hand sign: thumbs up or thumbs down? Just in general you know. Thumbs up or down?

Gryphon
2011-08-19, 8:26 PM
Just for funzies pick a number between 1 and 10

Maz
2011-08-19, 8:35 PM
Wish I could. I'm a good beta tester, even if it's my wife's account.

Wtgamerz
2011-08-19, 8:38 PM
8

Maz
2011-08-19, 8:39 PM
Hey Maz, completely unrelated question, but what's your favorite hand sign: thumbs up or thumbs down? Just in general you know. Thumbs up or down?


I like :yay:, and :annoyed:. They are my favorite emoticons.

Gryphon
2011-08-20, 4:54 PM
Hutball gameplay! Not the best angle but it shows a full match. 15 mins long, play of the game is around 12:20 IMO.

543lyjmr7yM

Sprint
2011-08-20, 5:20 PM
Didn't seem like anybody besides jedi/sith could actually kill anybody

TiltingWindmills
2011-08-20, 7:55 PM
Didn't seem like anybody besides jedi/sith could actually kill anybody

That is very much not true. I didn't think any non force using classes would be any good but I was wrong.

Drascus
2011-08-20, 8:32 PM
The Sith may be evil but the Jedi are just as bad. As a Jedi you can kill lots of people, you just can't feel strongly about it. So basically you train yourself to be a psychopath.

The Lazarus
2011-08-20, 8:57 PM
Pretty sure killing lots of people is usually a last resort for a Jedi!

Killjoy
2011-08-20, 9:15 PM
The Sith may be evil but the Jedi are just as bad. As a Jedi you can kill lots of people, you just can't feel strongly about it. So basically you train yourself to be a psychopath.
You have to blatantly ignore the vast majority of what the Jedi are about and what they do (their actions typically coinciding with the greater good) for this to be an even remotely viable argument.

Jimmy McForum
2011-08-20, 9:21 PM
The Sith may be evil but the Jedi are just as bad. As a Jedi you can kill lots of people, you just can't feel strongly about it. So basically you train yourself to be a psychopath.
In MY opinion, the JEDI are evil!

vrrn vrrrn kssh kssh vrrrwn kssh

choombatta
2011-08-20, 9:38 PM
Since when do Jedi kill swaths of innocent dissenters?

Maz
2011-08-20, 9:48 PM
Pretty sure killing lots of people is usually a last resort for a Jedi!

Pft, I have now mowed down damn near an entire cities population on my JK... Last resort my ass.

Panic at the Sisko
2011-08-21, 12:03 AM
The Sith may be evil but the Jedi are just as bad. As a Jedi you can kill lots of people, you just can't feel strongly about it. So basically you train yourself to be a psychopath.

uh

Kaete
2011-08-21, 12:13 AM
Ugh, why can't an MMO ever have an evil side that is actually and unapologetically evil? None of this "oh we're so misunderstood" or "the other side is just as bad" nonsense.

Panic at the Sisko
2011-08-21, 12:15 AM
Star Wars. Star Wars has that. The sith are that.

Wtgamerz
2011-08-21, 12:23 AM
Ugh, why can't an MMO ever have an evil side that is actually and unapologetically evil? None of this "oh we're so misunderstood" or "the other side is just as bad" nonsense.

^^^^^

Darius Sontag
2011-08-21, 12:27 AM
Star Wars. Star Wars has that. The sith are that.

The Sith though see themselves as "good" and justify themselves with the whole "order of things is for the strong to survive" blah blah "dark side is stronger and freedom" blah blah "the Jedi are cultists child brainwashing bastards" ect.

The Sith sadly don't go "we are fucking evil, deal with it."

Jobrill
2011-08-21, 12:31 AM
Ugh, why can't an MMO ever have an evil side that is actually and unapologetically evil? None of this "oh we're so misunderstood" or "the other side is just as bad" nonsense.

"Shades of Grey" MIGHT not bother me so much if the "We are totally shades of grey" side wasn't off commiting horrible atrocities in half their quests while insisting they're totally good guys -- and that the actual good guys are just bigoted racists and/or the REAL monsters. *coughhordecough*

Syngyne
2011-08-21, 12:38 AM
Ugh, why can't an MMO ever have an evil side that is actually and unapologetically evil? None of this "oh we're so misunderstood" or "the other side is just as bad" nonsense.
It was kind of a terrible MMO, but RF Online had the Accretia, whose entire philosophy was "If you aren't Accretia, fuck you."

The Accretian Empire follows a totalitarian regime where goals are for the Empire, a thought that is embraced by its followers. There is no feeling when it comes to the destruction of other races and for good reason, for the Accretia are a race of mechanised units with a materialistic thinking. The Accretia are proud to be the strongest and most formidable race in the galaxy, and are proud of the huge weapons they have created to kill men, women and all things living. Their need to expand to the further reaches of the universe to become even stronger is paramount and a key driving force to their being. This has inevitably led them to the Planet Novus and the arcane civilisations it plays home to.

Jobrill
2011-08-21, 12:41 AM
It's getting to the point where I sort of miss EQ, or at least am starting to prefer it's lore over WoW's. The Ogres, Trolls, Dark Elves, and Iksar, were all pretty much, "Yeah, we're evil," as were the worshippers of various gods of hate/fear/disease/death. It was pretty sweet.

Wtgamerz
2011-08-21, 12:45 AM
That's one of the things I loved about eq. Want to be evil? No problem, here's our wine list of classes and races, enjoy!

Pandir
2011-08-21, 12:45 AM
It's getting to the point where I sort of miss EQ, or at least am starting to prefer it's lore over WoW's. The Ogres, Trolls, Dark Elves, and Iksar, were all pretty much, "Yeah, we're evil," as were the worshippers of various gods of hate/fear/disease/death. It was pretty sweet.

I liked that too, it was pretty much a yeah we kill babies big whoop wanna fight about.

Drascus
2011-08-21, 12:56 AM
You have to blatantly ignore the vast majority of what the Jedi are about and what they do (their actions typically coinciding with the greater good) for this to be an even remotely viable argument.

What greater good would that be? I mean, if we're talking the movies, the jedi in the republic were corrupt assholes who were totally incompetent at their jobs, and shrugged off horrible evils like slavery, torture, etc, because "well this planet isn't really in the republic, lolz'.

Oh and they sever people's arms in bars for getting a bit shirty with them, and then tell the cowed citizens around them to fuck off, because this is "jedi business".

I fail to see the greater good in any of that shit. Yoda could have done so much to help the rebellion with just a simple hyperspace communicator, or hell, he could have arranged a way to send letters. Dagobah getting the occasional ship could easily have been explained as smugglers hiding their stash or whatever. Instead he turned his back on everything and hid.

Hell, obi-won lived on a planet with modern communications, even if it was a bit ass-end, he could have lent a hand to the rebels too.

The jedi code, as published by Lucas, is a horrible, 'kill your emotions and everything that makes you a feeling sapient" code. And it has glaring inconsistancies like, "never use the force to attack" but slashing the shit out of someone with your lightsaber is chill.

Darius Sontag
2011-08-21, 1:09 AM
What greater good would that be? I mean, if we're talking the movies, the jedi in the republic were corrupt assholes who were totally incompetent at their jobs, and shrugged off horrible evils like slavery, torture, etc, because "well this planet isn't really in the republic, lolz'.

Oh and they sever people's arms in bars for getting a bit shirty with them, and then tell the cowed citizens around them to fuck off, because this is "jedi business".

I fail to see the greater good in any of that shit. Yoda could have done so much to help the rebellion with just a simple hyperspace communicator, or hell, he could have arranged a way to send letters. Dagobah getting the occasional ship could easily have been explained as smugglers hiding their stash or whatever. Instead he turned his back on everything and hid.

Hell, obi-won lived on a planet with modern communications, even if it was a bit ass-end, he could have lent a hand to the rebels too.

The jedi code, as published by Lucas, is a horrible, 'kill your emotions and everything that makes you a feeling sapient" code. And it has glaring inconsistancies like, "never use the force to attack" but slashing the shit out of someone with your lightsaber is chill.

Yeah I have to agree, at least with the new trilogy the Sith were actually less evil than the Jedi.

The Jedi were cult like assholes who had a license to kill anyone they didn't agree with and seemed exempt from any oversight or system of due process.

On the other hand, the Sith while evil seemed to actually want to bring order to the galaxy. They only seemed to kill their actual enemies. Hell the Sith actually would give the odd Jedi the opportunity to join them while the Jedi were all about killing the Sith on sight.

Sure the Sith started the intergalactic war, but they seemed to minimize casualties. Like hell, the war was fought between robots and clones that might as well have been called "meat robots".

Hell even the war itself, the side of Count Dooku just wanted to seperate from the Republic. That's it. That intention, in itself, wasn't evil and was actually something reasonable for them to want.

Probably the most evil thing the Sith did in the new trilogy was kill the Jedi Children, which didn't make much sense to begin with. (Like seriously, Palpatine was all about corruption and the kids could have made the perfect Sith Assassins when grown up)

PMAvers
2011-08-21, 1:10 AM
Ugh, why can't an MMO ever have an evil side that is actually and unapologetically evil? None of this "oh we're so misunderstood" or "the other side is just as bad" nonsense.

Warhammer?

Bloody Jack
2011-08-21, 1:13 AM
In Warhammer they were supposed to be Chaos, not Evil. Somehow there didn't seem to be much distinction though :ermm:

Darius Sontag
2011-08-21, 1:15 AM
Warhammer?

Erm virtually all the sides have some justification on why they aren't evil. Hell Chaos Space marines still justify themselves that they were horribly wrong and missunderstood and the Emperor and the Imperium are the Evil ones. Probably the only side that doesn't bother to justify their actions as good is the Tyranids... and well that has more to do with the fact they don't talk as much.

Pandir
2011-08-21, 1:24 AM
Probably the most evil thing the Sith did in the new trilogy was kill the Jedi Children, which didn't make much sense to begin with. (Like seriously, Palpatine was all about corruption and the kids could have made the perfect Sith Assassins when grown up)

I thought the whole point was to further speed along Anakins fall and to make sure there was nothing of the jedi left.

Archangel3d
2011-08-21, 1:33 AM
Erm virtually all the sides have some justification on why they aren't evil. Hell Chaos Space marines still justify themselves that they were horribly wrong and missunderstood and the Emperor and the Imperium are the Evil ones. Probably the only side that doesn't bother to justify their actions as good is the Tyranids... and well that has more to do with the fact they don't talk as much.

Nah, at best the followers of Chaos are in the "beyond mere mortal morality" category. For them, there is no good or evil, there's pleasing their dark Gods and an eternity of torment. They've joined the "winning team" (in their eyes (all 7 of 'em)), but the price of entry is basically causing pain, suffering, corruption and wide-scale bloodshed.

At best, they will claim that they made the right decision for humanity, taking it to its logical and most fitting position as cherished servants of the masters of reality (i.e.: establish the pecking order when the gods of Chaos win). And they certainly don't do the whole hand-wringing "we're so misunderstood". If you don't understand, you get a bolter round through the skull.

Gryphon
2011-08-21, 2:02 AM
Pretty sure it has something to do with Disney all but owning Lucas Arts/Film and BW wanting to keep their T rating. If they let you play a Sith as a true Sith, that little Twi'lek slave the Sith Warrior gets would have so many horrible things done to her.

Munchausen
2011-08-21, 3:11 AM
What did I miss about the Sith not being evil in the game? I always understood it to be if you were an Empire character, YOU could choose a light side path, but it required hiding your good deeds or taking light side actions that could be justified (I didn't kill the disobedient captain because he was more valuable alive during the battle) and didn't really change what the Sith Empire stands for.

Tortuga Bañana
2011-08-21, 3:33 AM
I too wish there were more games where I could personally participate in unambiguously evil actions. The more cruel and gruesome, the better.

Kamileon
2011-08-21, 4:02 AM
The ambiguously good and evil sides is just an easy way to try to fit the bill for everyone. I am convinced that they design it that way on purpose.

If you want to be balls out evil, you can be a sith and be all "NO I AM BALLS OUT EVIL."
If you want to be ~*misunderstood*~ you can be a sith and justify all your shit and point your fingers at the other guy, and insist that you're not evil, and they're just as bad.
If you don't really give a shit, or you think you're better than those guys but you're not really convinced that they're balls out evil, you can be the republic.
If you're convinced that you're the paragon of light and virtue and would never punch someone through a plate glass window even if the option was there, and that you're fighting for all that is good and right and orderly in the universe in a completely justified battle against true evil in the world, then you become a Jedi Knight, and insist the Sith are the true evil.
Everyone has a place.

Phantom
2011-08-21, 1:09 PM
"The universe is a mess, and I just need to rule it."

That's actually going to be my new Sith character. I will call him Darth Horrible, and I will randomly burst into song.

Kickflip Jones
2011-08-21, 1:28 PM
I too wish there were more games where I could personally participate in unambiguously evil actions. The more cruel and gruesome, the better.Let me tell you about a little game called Kane & Lynch: Dead Men,

Laconic
2011-08-21, 1:40 PM
I too wish there were more games where I could personally participate in unambiguously evil actions. The more cruel and gruesome, the better.

You know TT, while I find your critical reviews of trolls to be pretty stellar your original work in the field still leaves something to be desired.

build me a star
2011-08-21, 9:02 PM
This is such a boring argument.

Sprint
2011-08-21, 9:17 PM
Warhammer's evil side is pretty out-and-out evil.

Killjoy
2011-09-15, 12:26 PM
A pretty neat crafting page/image:

http://www.alterswtor.com/archives/1978

frogurt
2011-09-15, 8:47 PM
Go here (http://www.alterswtor.com/archives/1071#more-1071), watch this video. It actually looks like there's a way of playing an Imperial Agent as something very close to a good guy.

I've really got to hand it to Bioware, the dialogue in that fan made trailer was surprisingly good.

Sam
2011-09-15, 8:57 PM
The Sith may be evil but the Jedi are just as bad. As a Jedi you can kill lots of people, you just can't feel strongly about it. So basically you train yourself to be a psychopath.

late to the party, but

no

I'll say it again: the sith side is evil, it's not ambiguous, if you play empire you are choosing to play for the evil side. You aren't straightjacketed into being evil personally because of your class choice, but you work for Evil Incorporated.

Default_Messiah
2011-09-15, 9:07 PM
You know, they keep mentioning Tarkin and that female assassin from the prequel films as the inspiration for the Imperial Agent. But honestly, it looks more like its cut from the same mould as the Operative in Serenity.

Which is super cool!

Gryphon
2011-09-16, 1:25 AM
According to leaks, everyone in the beta is saying that the Imp Agent's story just blows all the others out of the water in terms of awesomeness. Still not going go go IA first but I'm sure he'll make a great alt.

Jobrill
2011-09-16, 1:27 AM
You know, I was fine not playing SW:TOR. Didn't get a Beta invite, but I have WoW and no time or energy to play 2 MMOs at once, especially not if they're both subscription based.

Then I played KOTOR.

Damn it.

AKBoarder
2011-09-16, 1:34 AM
Is there a release date yet? I am going to need a new laptop it looks like. Well, I meet the minimum but not much more. Probably gonna get a refurbished MB Pro

Tesche
2011-09-16, 8:46 AM
No hard release date. I think Q4 is the broad time frame right now. Though, if you preorder the game, there are supposedly going to be lots of Beta Weekends/Weeks/Defined Periods of time starting later this month and continuing to release. Preorders will also get an "early start." Supposedly they are doing a staggered release, only releasing certain number of pre-orders an then a certain number of copies each week (which will of course be a lot) to try and avoid massive server issues at the start of the game, but we'll see if that happens and how it works out for them.

Jay
2011-09-16, 9:30 AM
I might consider trying this if it goes up on Steam.

Tesche
2011-09-16, 10:09 AM
I might consider trying this if it goes up on Steam.
Prob won't because of STEAM and EA's current issues and because of EA's new Origin service.

Wtgamerz
2011-09-16, 10:47 AM
Yeah I'm guessing all the head starters will get access through Origin.

Jay
2011-09-16, 11:01 AM
Pass then.

Killjoy
2011-09-16, 12:30 PM
You're going to pass on a game just because it isn't on Steam? It's one thing to pass on a game if you suspect it might suck, but I don't see this decision holding up at all if the game ends up being good.

Sprint
2011-09-16, 1:34 PM
It's an MMRPG, you'll not need the DVD to play, you can just download the client of the Internet anyway.

Steam is kind of redundant for MMO's.

Default_Messiah
2011-09-16, 5:07 PM
You know, if I had my druthers, I'd really like to see some Obsidian guys doing some of the story stuff for the game, and especially for the Sith. I mean, basically in all Star Wars media the sith are the most boring characters in the world, outside of the Emporer and Darth Vader in the original trilogy.

The only exception to that are the four sith characters in Kotor 2, who are just these really rich characters who are just filled with self-loathing, or are just so warped they don't really understand most of the emotions they're feeling at any given time.

Also, Kotor 2 was much more of a personal, headspace kind of story, which would probably fit the MMO style of play a little more.

But seriously. I'm interested to see what they do with sith stories and the 'fall of the Roman Empire' stuff sounds intriguing, but more often than not, Sith are just these pseudo-philosophising psychopaths who lack any real motivation or emotions because they have a case of 'the crazies'.

Jobrill
2011-09-16, 5:35 PM
We get enough "oh they're so not REALLY evil" BS from just about every major MMO currently on the market, and a good portion of the major fantasy series. I'm ready for a return to old school unrepentant psychopaths for once, frankly.

Default_Messiah
2011-09-16, 5:50 PM
We get enough "oh they're so not REALLY evil" BS from just about every major MMO currently on the market, and a good portion of the major fantasy series. I'm ready for a return to old school unrepentant psychopaths for once, frankly.

Well, no it's not that I don't want them to be villains, it's that I want them to be human beings, or at least interesting.

Like, Darth Malak is pretty much the dullest character in Kotor. He never does anything unexpected, or says anything unusual. He's pretty much a standard moustache twirler. Even that scene where they have a glimpse of that medical droid adjusting that thing in his throat is basically cribbed from Empire.

But in Kotor 2, someone like say, Darth Sion is this dude who is unrepentantly violent and cruel. But at the same time you can tell that he's someone who's been subject to a lot of mindgames, and it's made him into the bitter, twisted person who hates his old master, but also want to prove himself to her and is actually jealous of the attention she gives the exile.
He's written super well as this person who is believable as a person who only knows how to interact with the world through hate and violence. He's this incredibly creepy, stalkerish creature who is basically pitiable.

The thing I'm saying is that in like the Legacy comics the dudes have no character whatsoever. They're basically pretentious scowling dudes who are into body modification, and "the dark side" is basically used as an excuse to not invest any kind of agency or depth.

Not to mention I can't revel in causing destruction or being evil if it feels like I'm basically a cardboard cut-out.

Killjoy
2011-09-16, 6:12 PM
But in Kotor 2, someone like say, Darth Sion is this dude who is unrepentantly violent and cruel. But at the same time you can tell that he's someone who's been subject to a lot of mindgames, and it's made him into the bitter, twisted person who hates his old master, but also want to prove himself to her and is actually jealous of the attention she gives the exile.
He's written super well as this person who is believable as a person who only knows how to interact with the world through hate and violence. He's this incredibly creepy, stalkerish creature who is basically pitiable.
I concur. Kotor 2 had great writing.

frogurt
2011-09-21, 2:36 AM
If you're not in the beta and want more news than the official site is giving out each week, you might want to take a look at these sites:

http://www.alterswtor.com/
http://www.betacake.net
http://torguild.net/calculator/

From what I've been reading, this game is shaping up really well. Nothing revolutionary for an MMO, but it's well-polished and the writing is universally praised.

Killjoy
2011-09-21, 4:42 AM
My personal favorite is: http://darthhater.com/